> be me > writing fediverse-original greentext > does only appear correctly in certain viewersSaw this “stop posting content” rant, just below it in my feed is a “Why doesn’t anyone post on the fediverse!?!?” rant
I wonder if these things are related.
No one is saying to stop posting. There are dozens of communities that get little to no content because people dump all this crap here. All of these posts have at least one other community where they actually fit. Don’t twist words.
So downvote them?
Brave souls risk their lives and sanity digging those screenshots out of the cesspits for your viewing pleasure.
Tumblr is just the same as it always was. Which in the current blogging ecosystem, means it’s better than nearly every other website. Standards have really plummeted.
Oh in case people here don’t know, current Tumblr ownership is made up of insane transphobes. They’re kinda in an enteral standoff with… most of their dedicated user-base about it.
Also, back in the first Trump administration, a whole lot of black users got permabanned for spreading “Russian disinformation”. In reality, they were talking about their experiences being black in the US. But pointing out the flaws in the place you live is actually helping The Other! So very scary.
I didn’t make this meme.
Then let me put it this way:
OP didn’t say that memes can’t be textual in nature, OP complains about snappy Twitter, 4Chan, Reddit (idk about this one? Reddit does have memes in some subs) or similarly sourced screenshots of texts.
Such posts, while possibly humorous, and occasionally a bit funny, are not spread rapidly by Internet users, and rarely posted with any variation.Example 1 - this is a meme:
“Nanomachines, son!”Example 2 - this is not a meme:
I mean, if the screenshot has been shared widely enough, it should be considered a meme by definition.
If the screenshot has been shared widely enough by many different people, yes, it should be considered a meme by definition.
“By many different people” isnt part of either of the above definitions. Also, whats “many?” Whats “different” mean in this context? What is the threshold for a meme to meme? 10 people? 100? 1000?
Richard dawkins coined the term in 1976 and defined it as such:
A meme “conveys the idea of a unit of cultural transmission, or a unit of imitation”
Seems like a screenshot of text seen by hundred/thousands/millions fits that defention to me.
“Many” may be me editorializing, but “internet people” implies that it’s not just one person posting the same thing in many places around the web and people liking it.
Example 2 is a meme, no doubt about it.
If you go any deeper than the surface-level Google definition (that you are pedantically picking apart), then you will find literally any idea or unit of culture is a meme.
Read the last chapter of Richard Dawkins’ The Selfish Gene. Actually please read the whole book, it’s a masterpiece of science popularization. Or read Susan Blackmore’s The Meme Machine, it explains the concept of memes and how they evolve in further detail.
When everything is a meme, nothing is. That is why often there is a distinction made between the Richarf Dawkins type of meme and the modern internet meme.
When everything is a meme, nothing is
“When everything is made of genes, nothing is”
This is just an assertion, and a false one too.
Everything is a meme, and they behave exactly like genes. They replicate themselves, perfectly or imperfectly, and are then subject to competition for users’ attention which will affect their future replication.
Another meme is attempting to outcompete the screenshot genus of memes, by using you as a propagation tool: the “screenshots of text are not memes” meme.
Edit: downvote me if you want but you can’t deny the facts. The idea I expressed in this comment was also a meme whose chances of propagation were diminished from your downvote.
This is just a silly over-intellectualization of a weird word you want to mean “thing, but fancier”. I agree with the person you’re replying to. If everything is a meme then the term is meaningless.
Wrong
By your thinking, the letter A on a transparent background is a “meme”
To be fair,
If people post it around, it is.
Yeah
… it is.
By the most useless definition of the word I guess, but I don’t see how it is supposed to be meaningful to anyone but a linguist with that specific opinion.
Care to summarize what those books say that the surface-level Google definition provided to me by Antagonistic doesn’t?
I’m not going to read entire books just to defend my meme against another meme which defends a class of alleged memes.Well the definition is correct, it is Antagonistic’s narrow interpretation of that definition that is incorrect.
The key is evolution. For something to evolve, it must have the ability to be transferred, to be changed/mutated, and to be stored. Both genes and memes have these properties.
Literally any idea is a meme. If you can think it, it’s a meme.
If you break a gene in two, the result is two genes. If you break a meme in two, the result is two memes.
The name “Antagonistic” is a meme. The letter ‘A’ is a meme. The sound you make when you say ‘A’ is a meme. The idea of air vibrating to make sound is a meme.
I didn’t interpret anything. I posted a meme. Also, you misspelled my name if were meaning to mention me.
If any idea is a meme, is any meme an idea, and is there a direct causal relationship or is it a coincidence (or, can there be an idea that is not a meme)?
If so, and if the former, then the definition of “meme” is a synonym of “idea” and that would be that, but I don’t think most people use that definition.Note that I’m somewhat biased, loosely speaking I don’t consider raw microblog quips to fit a community / subreddit / virtual space called “memes”.
deleted by creator
That would mean that everything was a meme. And a definition that encompasses everything is worthless, arguably not even a definition (because nothing is defined).
Hahaha, looks like we’re back to arguing about the old No True Memesmen falacy…
Screenshots of text that you don’t like aren’t memes because of reasons
I never said I don’t like the screenshot I referenced, I just looked up for “twitter screenshot” on DDG and took a representative link. I find the content of the screenshot mildly amusing.
However, many people (including me) do not consider those to be memes;
if the most widely recognized definition of the word includes them, then I question its usefulness beyond a synonim for “funny quote”.Many people including you are dead wrong
because of reasons
like definition. words mean things? what nonsense.
are not spread rapidly by Internet users, and rarely posted with any variation
Most of the shit on here hasn’t been shared widely or rapidly. They’re at best aspiring memes.
The community should be renamed non-memes. If not, then that community should be created & every non-meme here cross-posted there.
Haters gonna hate, but you deserve this.
spoiler
Reddit (idk about this one? Reddit does have memes in some subs)
But you are completely right about what I complain about. A meme often contains text, and sometimes even is purely text (for example a popcultural reference in a text-only medium can be considered a meme), but a single (maybe even witty) tweet or a forum discussion without any further context is maybe funny, but not a meme.
The hidden parts don’t matter, the part you can see is the part that says OP is wrong and nothing anywhere in the rest of the definition changes that
Is that an AI-answer?
It’s the dictionary definition
But then you are missing or leaving something out:
Lol, I always love it when people have to split hairs so finely on definitions that they risk fission.
I made this joke elsewhere, but this is basically the No True Memesmen fallacy. The definition of meme includes these pictures, and trying to narrow the definition to exclude them is laughable.
When everything is a meme, nothing is. Ther is no adaptation, no cultural twist, no recontextualisation or any other relevant criteria in a screenshot of text and nothing else.
Ok, so just make up your own word that has the definition you want, or deal with your definition not being the same as others’. Because the definition of meme isn’t as specific as you want it to be.
I see this as no different than the people who argued that image macros aren’t memes.
Because the definition of meme
The Oxford Dictionary’s definition of a meme you meant to say.
For example, Jana Zündel (german article), a german meme researcher, stated that a meme always includes a recontextualisation. The Wiki page lists key characteristics such as intertextuality and cultural evolution.
There is a screenshot from reddit posted here earlier today, do you think that’s a meme? Can you take it, put it in a new context and have it keep its original context as a reference so that the new post would create a new idea building on the context? Or is it just a random story, maybe funny to some?
You keep saying that, it’s not getting any less wrong though
You can parody a piece of text. They literally just did it by overlaying wojack on top of the dictionary description.
Most posts here aren’t parodies. They’re just blanket text
I’m here for snappy Xitter, 4Chan, reddit or similarly sourced screenshots of texts, cuz i won’t open none of those sites.
there’s a reason you wont open those sites. lean into that and rid yourself of their taint.
Oppinion disregarded.
Ahahaha.
I’m gonna say posting screenshots is kind of parallel to the purpose of this place. Lemmy is an aggregator, a platform where content from other sites is linked/reposted.
Original content is still important, as without them, the website would die in a few weeks. But we should not ignore the value “crossposted” stuff adds to this place. I read a lot of great, original stories under the thread shown in your screenshot.
!science_memes@mander.xyz is a perfect example of this. It is filled with unoriginal content and screenshots but I genuinely learned more stuff in the comment section of that community compared to “serious” science communities in other platforms. That also has something to do with the quality of fediverse users of course, but my point stands
I was just about to comment this lmaoo
deleted by creator
The meme police
memestasi if you will
OP: 👏 TOMATO 👏 IS 👏 NOT 👏 A 👏 FRUIT 👏
Everyone: tomatoes are botanically considered a fruit
OP: ackshually I don’t like it in my fruit salad, therefore it is not a fruit
Let me fix this.
OP: 👏 TOMATO 👏 IS 👏 NOT 👏 A 👏 FRUIT 👏
Everyone: technically, a tomato is a fruit
OP: OK sure, but I don’t want it in my fruit salad
Everyone: fair enough, that makes sense.
Nah, OP is just straight denying that screenshots of text are memes. Claiming some bullshit like having to make some change to it for it to qualify as a meme. Just ignoring reposts of green texts, copypasta, reddit stories (poop knife, cylinder, cbat guy, etc etc etc etc), people getting ratioed on twitter, tumblr chains.
Like, wtf kinda change does OP want me to make if I wanna revive some old classic greentext. Draw a big red circle on it? Slap a wojak right in the middle?
Screenshots are lazy, sure, but they are definitely still memes. Whether an exact replica or not.
I mean, /greentexts exists
I wouldn’t say they’re memes inherently, though they can be if they’re the navyseals meme or something if it becomes iconic.
See, that’s the thing. They are still memes. Bits of information that are transmitted with or without modification.
If a copypasta isn’t iconic, that doesn’t mean it’s not a meme. It’s just a less successful meme than the navyseals meme. Same thing with greentexts, images, comics, reddit posts.
OP: ackshually I don’t like it in my fruit salad, therefore it is not a fruit
adds bacon to fruit salad
wrong
I like to throw this one around on occasion.
Edit: I’m looking through the community now in the past few hours…
Most of the “real” memes that get posted are terrible, so I can’t say I mind too much.
Feel free to make your own quality memes.
I came here to say this to you. Be the change! Flood the zone with what you want to see. We’d all appreciate it.
That’s literally what they did…
Why fo you feel the need to tell me what I am already doing though?
Because you aren’t anymore. Where is today’s? I would like several please.
Anything humans spread around and share other than our DNA is a meme. The definition of a meme is “non-genetic information shared by any means.”
Behold, a meme:
And a tomato is a fruit. It would be stupid to pretend it should be utilised by its definition.
A tomato is a fruit. And all fruit are vegetables, but not all vegetables are fruit.
Sounds like you should crack open a dictionary.
a tomato is a fruit
Yeah, I know. I said that.
a tomato is a vegetable
Never said it wasn’t.
So you weren’t being sarcastic?
No? Have you never heard the analogy: “intelligence is knowing a tomato is a fruit, wisdom is knowing not to put it in a fruit salad” ?
Experience tells me cherry tomatoes are great in a fruit salad.
the word meme gained a second definition on the internet, which is similar to the first but focused on specifically things intended to be funny. because context is a part of language whether you like it or not, that meaning is the one that is being used any time you see the word on the internet unless otherwise specified or unless the context in which you’re seeing it is one where the other is more appropriate (like a discussion about linguistics or the spread of ideas).
Nothing in either definition requires them to be funny
i said intended to be funny. for example, the 67 meme is not funny. it is intended to be funny though, and like most new memes recently is intended to be funny mainly by referencing how it otherwise isn’t funny. theres a guy on yt shorts (I think the channel is etymologynerd or smth similar) who explains it a lot better.
I would argue that memes aren’t necessarily meant to be funny. I think the most important component of a meme is its composition, which is usually a square image with optional text. But yeah, I completely agree with your broader points.
there are also memes (meaning the kind intended to be funny on the internet in this case) which dont use images at all but are just a recurring reference or something like that. it is largely the same idea as the original meaning of the term but on the internet it generally refers to things that are intended to be funny (in recent years, usually through self-reference as a result of algorithm-based social media).
That’s fair, but I was thinking in the context of meme communities like this one in which nearly all of the posts are images.
usually a square image with optional text.
Thats an image macro which is a specific type of Internet meme. Although I’ve never heard of someone suggesting they must be square; that seems very odd. Are the meme police checking height:width ratios now?
There is no meme police and nobody uses the term image macro.
because context is a part of language whether you like it or not
The irony of this reasoning is that the things spread as memes you do not think should be called memes because they are not “intended to be funny” are called memes by a vast majority of people on the internet. Making them memes, whether you like it or not.
if you actually read the comment, I didnt say that anything was not a meme. what I said was that the person I was replying to was ignoring the other meaning of the word which, because of context, is clearly the relevant meaning in this case.
You’re presuming most people regard text on a selfie as a meme.
I’m convinced the majority of people think a meme is a recurring image format with humerous intent (more or less).
For what its worth, I’m of the opinion that words are not prescribed, words are defined by their use.
This may seem contradictory, until you realise that you can’t just let every definition of a word be equal and valid.
If my definition of a meme was a blue towel, which was shared by ten other people, then asking you to fetch my meme (blue towel) is moronic.
People holding onto the idea that memes should be defined by their original context are using the same rhetoric as those who insist it’s okay to call cigarettes “fags”
